Season 4, Episode 145 : Richard Morris

Will Richardson 00:05
Welcome to the Green Element podcast where we meet business leaders and innovators transforming their operations to be more environmentally and socially sustainable, and in the process help you on your journey of sustainability. I'm your host Will Richardson. Today, we are speaking with Richard Morris, the CEO of IPG mediabrands, a global media company founded in 2007, which has over 13,000 employees in over 130 countries. Richard is responsible for all the networks agencies and the business units in the UK, including UM, Initiative, Reprise Network, MAGNA, Rapport, and Orion. Prior to this, Richard gained valuable experience working for the Dentsu Aegis network. Richard, welcome.

Richard Morris 00:50
Hi, Will. Thanks for having me on the show.

Will Richardson 00:53
It's great to have you with us today. So, before we get into sustainability and marketing, could you give us a bit of background about yourself and how you came to work for IPG mediabrands.

Richard Morris 01:03
So, yeah, I suppose it's been a long career, a long and exciting career in advertising. And about four years ago, I was seduced by what media brands were doing globally as a business, and it was something I wanted to be part of. I was fortunate enough to be given the opportunity to run the operation in the UK and Ireland.

Will Richardson 01:26
Brilliant. So what leadership role do you think the marketing sector should take with regards to climate emergency?

Richard Morris 01:35
It's a really good question, and fortunately, it's one that the market is now open to. I think it's definitely something that mediabrands has been banging the drum of for over a decade now. But really, clients now fully appreciate the importance of presenting ethical businesses and sustainable businesses to their customers, and it's their customers that are demanding it. So there is fortunately little resistance to the principle and ambition of becoming more sustainable.

Will Richardson 02:13
Do you think it helps that, as you've just alluded to, you've been working, as IPG mediabrands, in sustainability and being more sustainable for coming up to 20 years? And I know that personally, because we've been the company behind the scenes, and you've had net savings annually of about 110,000 pounds; that's for your London operations alone. And with that amount of background and your real drive as an organisation in the operations, do you think that has a knock on effect to working with your clients?

Richard Morris 02:53
I think it does. As a marketing services operation, we are very privileged to work at the very senior levels with our clients. We preside over a lot of their investments in growing their business, positioning their brands, improving their reputations. And as such, we have a lot of responsibility. So, through our own advocacy of sustainable practices, that's something that our clients are very interested in now. And anyone who works in the advertising or media sector will know that on every single RFI that's issued for a pitch, clients want to know about the sustainable practices that the prospective agencies have and the beliefs that they have around the space.

Will Richardson 03:44
What way or ways have IPG Media Group changed in response to the climate emergency?

Richard Morris 03:50
There are two ways of looking at it. The first thing is that we don't see this as a point of competitive advantage, and we have joined forces with all the other brilliant marketing services businesses in the UK. We've done that through the Advertising Association and we've done that through the IPA, which is the Institute of Practitioners of Advertising. And together as a collective, we're hugely competitive businesses. We compete all the time, but we found a common goal in this space. So we have co-created along with those bodies, and along with our competitors Ad Net Zero, which is done through the Advertising Association, which is a five point plan to get to Real Net Zero by 2030 for the UK advertising industry. And among that five point plan is one: getting our own house in order, which is something that we're really focused upon. So, we have been working with 100% renewable energies, we ban single-use plastics from our business, we've reduced our carbon footprint per employee by 72%, since 2014. So it's a huge focus for us, we're about to move to a new flagship office, and that entire process has been governed through the lens of sustainability. The second area that's really important, of course, isn't getting our own house in order, but it's how we help our clients make sustainable choices. And you can imagine, when a client is choosing between a digital campaign, a social media campaign, an out of home campaign, television campaign, cinema, radio, whatever it might be, that each comes with its own carbon implication. So along with the other members of the IPA, we've developed a carbon calculator. What we're now beginning to do, this is very nascent in the last few weeks, we are now putting carbon scores on our media plants. So clients can see, how best to put it, how they can see the choices they're making, and the implications from an environmental impacts of one plan versus another. And it's this behaviour that we believe is going to influence the good, the total output of the UK advertising industry.

Will Richardson 06:27
I mean that's really, really good because a lot of the negative carbon input does tend to come from the clients wanting to change things, doesn't it? All best laid plans are suddenly changed because someone comes in and says, actually, we'd like to do this, this and this, and you're like, ah, right okay, that's gonna have massive implications.

Richard Morris 06:52
Yeah.

Will Richardson 06:53
And I think what you've just said is really good because it helps communicate that message, doesn't it?

Richard Morris 06:58
It does, and I think without generalising too much, we're in an era now where all brand's behaviour adds up to a consumer's assessment of how well that brand was performing. So, an example would be, a renewable electricity proposition couldn't be advertised or communicated in a sort of unsustainable way, as it were. So every single element of the supply chain needs to be focused upon that goal. One of the challenges, of course, that we will confront is that quite rightly, brands, when they invest in advertising or communications, there is a whole list of different objectives that might be reducing the cost per action or visits to a website or a mobile site; it might be changing perception of a brand or gaining awareness of a new product, whatever it might be. And those may, not saying they are, but there will be times when those might be at odds with the most sustainable. So that trade off is something that we are going to have to get comfortable with but there is definitely a desire to do all that we've got to really and appreciate that sustainability is a vital component going forward, but there are other factors that determine that media count.

Will Richardson 08:22
Yeah, we'd work with CLICKON on the Landrover ad with a competitor of yours, but it was more that they were meant to be doing this Landrover ad in Iceland, and they ended up they could do it all through, I think augmented reality.

Richard Morris 08:37
Yeah.

Will Richardson 08:38
But what I was quite interested in was, Yes, more sustainable, but kind of what you're, I think, alluding to, in that if you can have local agencies in say Argentina, doing a drive through the mountains or doing something there, you're actually putting more money into local economies, and you're still able to spread the wealth. And so it brings in that ethical side, and rather than shipping loads of people out to all the countries, you're working with more people around the world.

Richard Morris 09:15
Yeah, I think it's a fantastic example, and it's amazing that is being considered because let's be frank 10-15 years ago, that was the last thing. It would all be about cheapest of talents and whether there was a good light that would determine the location of production. So, I think now that in that example shows how not only is a sustainable practices coming to the fore, but also thinking about the impact upon local economy, which again is a good consideration from an ethical business, which is great to hear.

Will Richardson 09:56
What is IPG Media doing to ensure brands are communicating honestly, and in particular, what is it you're doing to ensure messages about sustainability in the environment are communicated honestly?

Richard Morris 10:08
I think there is enough evidence now to show -. I think one of the things that the internet has done-. I remember reading an article right at the beginning of the internet, probably out 22 years ago, when he says,

Will Richardson 10:23
[laughs] [inaudible]

Richard Morris 10:23
[laughs] I was obviously a student at the time. But yeah, it was a big feature of the economist, the first line is that the good people will get better, and the bad people will disappear. And whilst I'm sure that's a bit neat and a bit simplistic, I think what has happened is that you've no longer got a gap in between the claim and the delivery. So before the internet, perhaps generalisation, you could make a claim in advertising and if that stimulated the purchase, and the product experience or the service experience, didn't marry up with the claim, it was sort of okay. And now there is so much knowledge out there about supply chains, ethical practices, product quality, product experience, service experience, that you cant say anything that is disingenuous in communications, and expects to deliver strong customer advocacy, it just doesn't work anymore, which is a brilliant thing. So I think what that means is now, and you see it, you just have to take a sample of communications. You see that there's far more authenticity, there's far less hyperbole in communications because they know that there are a million people who are very quickly willing and easily accessible to give an opinion on that proposition. So I think we are, of course, helping our clients and encouraging our clients to be as authentic as possible. Again, I would say that we are in that instance, talking to a converted audience. So, that's not difficult. I think the interesting dilemmas come in is when you're having, as I said before, to weigh up different types of objective, because there are ways of hacking growth that might mean that you're delivering excessive frequency to consumers, which might be annoying for them so actually might be not seen as a positive practice. So, when you look at more sustainable marketing practices that might come up free, and it's educating clients at that premium is one that's worth investigating.

Will Richardson 13:01
Have you found there are conflicts between the short-term and long-term benefits, with regard to honest marketing communications?

Richard Morris 13:08
Yeah, I think it's a really good question. I think one of the other, the rise of social media and digital media is so much more targeted, it's incredibly good value. It's highly attributable, you can measure and track it. It's become very attractive to clients to invest in digital media, per se, and across all social platforms. I think one of the dangers is getting hooked on short-term response. So, let's take a hypothetical example: a business that is investing in sustainabilitymmay not see the benefit of that in terms of its bottom line for a few years, relative to some short-term deal that might have an instant impact on the business. Now, the dilemma that many brands have had is that short-term versus long-term. Fortunately, I think what you've seen since the last recession of 2008, is brands really appreciating or feeling the cost of reducing their investment in what they stand for, in favour of short-term direct response activity, and actually now, when we went through the economic challenges of last year, you see many brands maintain their investment in what they stood for. And that tells me that there is a definite a greater appreciation and understanding and commitment to the long term than perhaps there was 12 years ago.

Will Richardson 14:58
Because there are some people that are more passionate about sustainability than others. We see that across the board. Are you recognising different people and putting them in with different brands? Or? I don't know. I'm just thinking about from a cultural point of view and do you put the person that's a real kind of like 'greeny' with Ecover or the reverse with another company, which I'm not going to say. But you know.

Richard Morris 15:29
It's a good question. Honestly, when we pitch and have that first connection with a client, we are very open about our own values, and sustainability and ethical practices are at the heart of our values, that is something we will over-emphasise in those initial meetings. And we will connect with like-minded clients, and some of the clients might not be interested in that space or as interested as we are, so there tends to be a sort of matching of values and culture. That means that the vast majority of our clients are on the same page as us, meaning we don't really have to segment on that basis.

Will Richardson 16:27
Do you think the marketing sector and advertising sector is doing enough to tackle greenwashing? And ultimately, is it doing enough to tackle the global crisis?

Richard Morris 16:38
I think it is, I'm more intimately involved with the UK and Ireland so I can talk from our perspective. Yeah, the things that the Advertising Association has done around that net zero, the IPA around the climate charter on a more global basis, the climate pledge that many of our clients are involved with. So, we are doing a lot, I think there's some real existential questions that come with advertising, like what are you promoting? So if you're advertising people to buy more petrol cars, or whatever it is, is that positive environment. However, what you're seeing is that those legacy companies that perhaps were having more of a negative impact on the environment, are the ones where change is being driven the fastest. So I think, I would say there is so much more we've got to do, we've only just started, but I think there is a real intent and conviction for advertising to play its part.

Will Richardson 17:53
That's really good to hear. And what are the challenges and opportunities within the advertising industry for communicating sustainable practices, products, etc?

Richard Morris 18:04
Well, core to our business is media and working with media vendors, from Google and Facebook through to cinema, to ITV, Channel Four, across the piece. And those businesses are very much focused on sustainable practices. But one of the things that we can do is ensure that our clients wishes and what we believe are the right ethical practices are promoted to those vendors. So, we've developed a set of 10, what we're calling responsibility principles, that we've shared with all of the vendors that our clients we work with, saying: these are the practices we want to promote. And then we, on a regular basis, audit their performance against those criteria, and publish it. So in the area of sustainability, we are encouraging, we are reflecting our clients wishes in our own wishes for our industry and the media marketplace to be more of a sustainable one. So by doing that, that puts some positive pressure on those businesses to accelerate their programmes. And that knock on effects through the supply chain is really having a positive impact.

Will Richardson 19:31
It was a brilliant initiative that you're doing. I've got down here that you're including protecting children's wellbeing, providing more transparency.

Richard Morris 19:40
Absolutely.

Will Richardson 19:41
And I was just gonna say incorporate sustainability. Sorry if I keep cutting you off [laughs].

Richard Morris 19:47
Yes, indeed, yes, indeed. And obviously, it goes beyond that and anything from data privacy, to welfare of children, sustainable practices. Broadly we don't inflate our sense of importance but we understand our influence and our responsibility, and that's what we're trying to leverage for good.

Will Richardson 20:10
Everything has a knock-on effect with each other, and you can't think about just one, you know, just the environment, it really does come through. And I guess something that I read about a lot is that the empowering of women has such a positive knock on effect for the environment, because of the way that culture has set up around the world. And as an example of how one thing has a massive impact on another part, it's all interconnected. So I think it's brilliant what you guys are doing with regards to that.

Richard Morris 20:48
Yeah, and that is a really good point. And it's something that's so high on our agenda, which is creating a more diverse, equitable, and inclusive culture and environment, which is representation, it's ensuring that the culture itself is inclusive, and again, promoting that within our organisation but also in the way we interface with our clients.

Will Richardson 21:18
Can you give us some examples of how you're doing that?

Richard Morris 21:21
So yeah, obviously something like the the gender pay gap is a massively important piece to us, we will regularly look at all of our data, see where we have anomalies, if there are anomalies in certain areas try and determine why we have inequality in a certain area, when it comes to black and people of colour talent, where we are off the pace as an industry. And you know, we have got so much work to do. We're looking at this in three ways. The first is about attraction, the second is attrition, and the third is advancement. So, the first point is ensuring that we have strong representation over and above national average amongst those ethnic groups, and that changes everything. So it makes you really question the way you operate. So, through like many businesses, we encourage people to refer someone to us but if we are asking the same people to refer their friends, they're less likely to give ourselves the representation, so we have changed that policy. You know, we had, quite frankly, an outmoded policy around insisting that people had university degrees come into our business that has gone, we've implemented blind CVs, we've created a heritage network in our business, so that the business can hold a mirror up to us and see if the practices that we're delivering are right. But the first goal within those three aims is to ensure we have strong enough representation in our business, then we need to make sure that we have an inclusive culture that enables [inaudible].

Will Richardson 23:17
The advertising industry is actually quite similar to the sustainability industry. But you're much further on than us. As in you guys have been talking about historically the lack of diversity within your industry for quite a number of years now. And I'm sad to say that the sustainability industry falls into that, we do have a lack of diversity within it. And we can talk about why at another time. But there are there are clear reasons why, and it's just it's interesting to know what to do, because it's something that I'm aware of, and just listening to you and understanding how to combat it.

Richard Morris 23:58
Yeah, it's very challenging. I think we pride ourselves on being an inclusive culture. But at the moment, last year with the murder of George Floyd, and the reaction amongst our own people and across society as a whole, it was a very changing moment for us that made us wake up and say we've just got to work so much harder at this in terms of time we dedicate to it and how we can affect real change. And it's something that's very important to us. As an organisation we're evaluated in terms of global network performance of the market, as with other markets globally, we are strongly evaluated on our ability to improve our representation. And I think there's this phrase about how you treasure what you measure but having those goals are so important because we're all very focused on improving this business. And there is absolutely no doubt that a diverse culture, a diversely represented workforce will deliver diversity of thinking and in the creative space within which we operate will deliver a better product. So it's thankfully an area where all the stars align. But it's something that we've got a long way to go in helping the industry change.

Will Richardson 25:22
Finally, what is the future of IPG Mediabrands look like with regards to sustainability?

Richard Morris 25:28
Well, that's an interesting one. In November, we will move to Old Bailey, which is a building that has had much sustainable passion built into its foundations. So from it's very inception, right through to the briefing of the architect, through the build, through everything, we are really, really driven by making that a landmark of sustainability. So that's going to be part of our immediate future. I see this one iterate, we think that the carbon calculator is a really interesting step because at first point, we will simply be reporting the carbon impact of certain advertising campaigns versus another. But over time, we see that variable becoming more and more important, but likewise, it's going to ensure that the vendors are going to be more sustainable in their practice. So, this is a journey, it's not going to be delivered overnight. What I can say is, we're absolutely committed to it, along with our clients. So, what I see, If we take out net zero, is by 2030 a real net zero position for the UK advertising industry, and we will ensure that Mediabrands plays a leading role in effecting that change.

Will Richardson 27:11
It's very rare that I can actually sit here and I know that it's true. I know that what you're saying is true because we've been working for you for long enough. We know that the drive is there, and we know how much you save year on year. And you're one of the examples I always give to companies where they will say but you can't just keep on reducing, and I say well actually you can because it comes down to organisations change, and that's the bit that we forget. You as IPG Mediabrands are not the same company as you were in 2010. You're in the same building, but you're not the same company. And so therefore, you've got more people, sometimes you've got less people, you've got different projects, and you've got more digital, and everything is constantly changing. And so therefore you are actually always reducing. And yes, 20% one year, doesn't attribute to the same 20%. It's another 20%. But it's like 18%. But as long as you're continually looking and evaluating your business, which is what you guys do every day. I mean, you're looking at half hour data, you could argue you're doing every half hour, you're not physically doing every half hour, but it's brilliant. It's absolutely brilliant to see an organisation like yours, doing what you're doing.

Richard Morris 28:33
I'm so pleased you said that. And also, thanks for all your support in keeping us honest, in that space. I think, when you talk about values and purpose, you can write value from a PowerPoint chart, but there's a difference between really living and breathing, and we do, and creating a responsible business is fundamental to that. And we say it's much about us, keeping our own house in order, but the wider impact that we can have to the advertising and media industry. So it's definitely, definitely at the top of the agenda.

Will Richardson 29:12
On the ground, we all need a Billy don't we [laughs] [inaudible].

Richard Morris 29:18
Yes. So yeah, he's been a fantastic driver within our organisation, to again, to keep us honest, and it's had amazing effects. So, it's wonderful to have the privilege to be able to run a business that is looking at sustainability, not only through a cost-efficiency lens, but also its impact on society and environment. And it's wonderful.

Will Richardson 29:47
Brilliant. Well, thank you so much for joining us today.

Richard Morris 29:51
It was an absolute pleasure.

Will Richardson 29:52
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